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12-10-18 04:47 AM
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Xeogaming Forums - Entertainment - Last Movie You Saw? Thoughts?
  
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Rogue
Posts: 11712/11722
Saw "Bohemian Rhapsody" in Dolby Atmos, truly the best format to watch it in. All the music just vibrates through you.
Rogue
Posts: 11671/11722
Saw "BlacKkKlansman" last night.

It's just a reminder that we absolutely need to go vote.
Rogue
Posts: 11647/11722
His motivation for killing off half the universe is totally different from the comics, which is pretty much just Thanos trying to impress Death and get her to date him. I wasn't sure how I felt about the change.

Lord Alexandor
Posts: 400/400
Originally posted by Xeoman
I kind of want to see Infinity War now since Thanos sounds like a legit good villain finally for once?

Finally, a villian that is a match for the Avengers. He can throw down with Hulk and not break a sweat... Its legit.
Xeoman
Posts: 11545/11607
I kind of want to see Infinity War now since Thanos sounds like a legit good villain finally for once?
Lord Alexandor
Posts: 398/400
I really like the Marvel Cinematic Universe, but Infinity War was a bit...dramatic? IDK, it wasn't my favorite. I did really like Solo, though! It was a nice change of pace for the Star Wars Universe. =D
Rogue
Posts: 11644/11722
Since the last post I've seen "Infinity War" and "Solo." I vastly preferred "Solo."

I'm just very over the Marvelverse.

Then again, didn't stop me from finally sitting down and reading "Infinity Gauntlet."
Rogue
Posts: 11630/11722
"Black Panther" was pretty good.

Rogue
Posts: 11609/11722
There was just as much divisiveness when Empire came out. People were shocked at how the optimistic ending they got with "Star Wars" would carry on to a film that ultimately bummed everyone out. Luke loses his hand? Han's frozen in carbonite? Darth Vader's Luke's father? WHAAAAAAT?!

And they were pretty much writing the original trilogy movie to movie. It's the Lucas way. TLJ was at least fleshed out around the same time TFA was shooting.

Getting deeper into this new generation (I'm currently reading the TFA novelization, which expands in various directions and is canon. I've read the script and have been watching/reading behind-the-scenes stuff), so many things that were in TLJ were ultimately presented within TFA and the extended universe books and Rian Johnson just carried them over. I mean, it's been neat seeing TFA with fresher eyes.

I can go over each of the points of contention, if we really want.

Let me start with one point, though: The First Order are NOT meant to be Nazis. They are neo-Nazis. Something far worse and easily findable within our universe. They're the impressionable youth who saw what one fucked up generation did and are going, "I could do that! Yes, I found my place!" These could be ANYBODY within your acquaintance.

Snoke says on Hux leaving and Kylo entering the scene, "You wonder why I keep a rabid cur in such a place of power? A cur's weakness, properly manipulated, can be a sharp tool." This is to say he's keeping both of them in their places of power -- as incompetent and ridiculous as they seem -- because he's ultimately just pulling their strings, making them dance while toying with their egos, and keeping confident that neither one will attempt to overthrow him. Hux and Kylo have a lot in common (both have killed their fathers, both are denied higher ranks by Snoke [Hux is technically Grand Marshall, but is still only a general, Kylo's constantly put down as a stupid kid apprentice, etc], and of course both of them want to rule the galaxy. Based on the end shots of Hux, he's MOST LIKELY going to stage a coup against Kylo, thus being the big villain in Episode IX.


Now the "running out of gas" storyline -- what's the problem? The Resistance was backed by the New Republic. Hux carried out a genocide on them in TFA, blowing away the New Republic. The First Order caught them in the middle of evacuation with dwindling resources and they probably figured so long as they made a jump to get away from the First Order, they'd be fine picking up fuel elsewhere. Hyperspace tracking is completely new tech, something that came up in "Rogue One," and now Hux is using it. So long as the Raddus stayed out of the Supremacy's destructive range, since its smaller and can move faster on thrusters, their shields kept them from getting taken out. It's stalling, sure, but they needed to form a plan, thus Holdo coming up with hiding on Crait.

Why didn't Holdo just tell Poe her plan to begin with? Because the plan was need-to-know and he was demoted for his brashness. He, Finn, and Rose conspired to "save" the Resistance with this longshot master cracker plan that everyone in the audience expected would work. They didn't inform Holdo of it. And then when Poe DOES find out Holdo's plan, what did he do? He threw a tantrum and then spread the confidential information to Finn and Rose, who were on speaker phone with DJ in the room, thus the info getting sold to the First Order and hundreds of Resistance members getting slaughtered when their shuttles are detected. Had Poe just accepted Holdo's command, they would have escaped to Crait without incident to hide out. Poe FINALLY learns that not everything can be solved by jumping in an X-wing and blowing things up, that retreat is a VALID strategy, and that potential losses should be considered. It's like how in a lot of superhero movies, the hero is just destroying the city, taking out buildings here and there (even if accidentally), probably killing thousands of people, to take out the one bad guy. And fuck yes on Holdo just turning around and taking out dozens of Star Destroyers and the Supremacy.

I've seen a lot of complaints about how the bombs got dropped from Paige's ship. All right. Star Wars vessels have plasma windows that are usually ever present. It's why Star Destroyers have those gaping hangars that look like they just open into vacuous space with TIE fighters flying in and out while troopers are just standing in formation next to parked ships. There's an invisible barrier. That's MY assumption when it came to the bomber. Why did the bombs just continue to drop in zero gravity? Because the ships are outfitted with gravity generation, hence why no one just floats around inside them. Once the bombs are released within that false gravity and enter into space inertia takes over and they continue in a straight line with no friction to slow, stop, or redirect them. This is just the way physics works within their universe, and yes, it's more fantasy and fairy tale than science.

Originally posted by Xeoman
I still absolutely hate Kylo Ren (and Adam Driver I guess). He comes off as a complete bitch and is just annoying. Now that this guy is the final boss and all the other interesting characters are killed off, it's becoming increasingly harder to care at all.

Sort of the point. Kylo Ren's an insecure kid in a mask. He tries to be punk, but Rey exposes that insecurity while he's interrogating her in TFA. "You ... you're afraid that you will never be as strong as Darth Vader." He's been living in the shadow of this iconic villain ever since Snoke took him. He destroys the mask and thus you never hear the Imperial March sound cues again thereafter.

And getting to his backstory: Mom and Dad abandoned him to their respective lives -- Leia to politics and Han to smuggling and roguing around with Chewie. He especially nope'd the fuck out of there when his son started showing force sensitivity. So young Ben Solo, having no real parental influence in his life gets dumped on Uncle Luke to be his padawan. Luke then goes through the internal struggle of whether or not to kill him (following along the "Would you go back in time and kill Hitler as a child, if given the chance?" hypothetical.)

The one place he felt he could turn was an inexplicable, all-powerful being who Stockholm'd him and offered to teach him how to be a badass motherfucker too. During that time, he didn't learn how to properly speak to women, how to express love or compassion, or how to achieve his goals without resorting to violence. The universe failed him, just as it failed Rey, another abandoned soul (what gives gravitas to him saying to her, "You're not alone" and her, "You're not either.") He has a warped sense of right and wrong, which follows with how Adam Driver says he plays Kylo. As he put it, Kylo doesn't see himself as evil, just that he believes he's doing what he considers is right by any means necessary. You then get into the debate of, "What is evil?" Everyone we deem evil just thinks they're doing what is right. This is how they justify genocide, murder, rape, etc. Take Hux wiping out the planets of the New Republic. It's to fit within Snoke's plan of "restoring order" and Hux was following orders.


As for Luke:


No character should be completely perfect (be it absolutely good or evil.)
Elara
Posts: 9594/9638
Space Magic is a good point. And I think a lot of the issues with the plot otherwise were because there was not much communication between JJ and Rian going into writing the script for TLJ so threads that JJ left in TFA were changed or ignored and it seemed a bit off because of that. Totally agree that JJ is better than the guy who did Jurassic World... cause yeah... no. Even though I was half expecting a riff from Beastie Boys to end up in the soundtrack of TFA somewhere when I heard he was doing it.

I guess I am one of the people that feels the new trilogy would have benefited from coming up with a trilogy arc idea before writing the scripts so there was development and overall cohesion... granted, Carrie passing would have forced a rewrite of Episode IX anyway. I just hope they give Leia a good end.
Rogue
Posts: 11604/11722
As terrible as it's probably going to be, I'm still going to see it, since JP is one of my fandoms. The first movie was magical and I saw it several times in the theater as a little kid. Every installment has been pretty shabby since, but I've seen every single one of them in the theater and I can't stop now.

"Jurassic World" was not great. It had its moments, but there was a lot of shit to sit through in the interim. I wouldn't have trusted that director with this.
Xeoman
Posts: 11534/11607
Originally posted by Rogue
Originally posted by Xeoman
I can give it this, TLJ is certainly better than Star Trek Into Darkness haha.

As a Trekker, I completely agree. We'd always felt he was only doing Trek as an audition for Star Wars. We can only hope he's learned from the errors he made with "Into Darkness." Still, at least the Trek movies are only meant to be an alternate universe, not canon.

I'm just glad the guy who did "Jurassic World" has been fired off Episode IX.

Yeah that could have been very bad haha.

Jurassic World... somehow the next one looks even worse.
Rogue
Posts: 11603/11722
Originally posted by Xeoman
I can give it this, TLJ is certainly better than Star Trek Into Darkness haha.

As a Trekker, I completely agree. We'd always felt he was only doing Trek as an audition for Star Wars. We can only hope he's learned from the errors he made with "Into Darkness." Still, at least the Trek movies are only meant to be an alternate universe, not canon.

I'm just glad the guy who did "Jurassic World" has been fired off Episode IX.
Xeoman
Posts: 11533/11607
I'd have to double check when and where how the progression there with Luke goes, but he does see his home and aunt and uncle burned to death. So he lost everything, putting stock in faith overnight from those dire circumstances seems believable.

I can give it this, TLJ is certainly better than Star Trek Into Darkness haha. Which makes me worry even more about Episode 9 when I remember just how unbalanced JJ can be. Frankly I don't even think he's that great in general. Disney seems afraid to let established veteran directors tackle Star Wars.
Rogue
Posts: 11599/11722
I'm not out to defend what others have deemed flaws or tell people that it's the greatest movie ever (I've already conceded that "Coco" was the superior film in terms of story, etc), but I'll just throw some insight onto why I dig it so hard.

Originally posted by Elara
And the Reylo scenes are good overall, but it just seemed a bit rushed. Maybe if it had stretched out over more time, but it just seemed like it went from "You're a monster, I despise you" to "I feel so alone and you're the only one that gets it" faster than a Formula 1 driver. I mean, I am intrigued... I really am... but it just was too fast.

We've become spoiled by the slowburn, intricate development we get with TV these days. Relationships and sexual tension builds over the course of seasons. Still, there's people pissed that they didn't kiss or do more. Can't please everyone?

Originally posted by Xeoman
Rey and Kylo's shift makes no sense. Let's not forget that only mere days separate the events from TFA and TLJ. Days ago she see's Kylo kill his own father, but now she's getting a little blushed seeing him without a shirt and wants to be buddies. Just doesn't seem believable.


As for the quick passage of time for things to develop, let's explore that, shall we?

Luke Skywalker finds Ben Kenobi in the desert. Ben -- revealing that he's Obi-Wan -- tells Luke about the Force. Cut to a few scenes later when Luke's practicing against the remote with the Legacy saber and Han's cracking wise. Luke gets indignant and says, "You don't believe in the Force, do you?" The kid literally went from 0 to devoutly religious in a matter of hours. He jumped into it with all his heart.

If you read enough of the scripts, novelizations, and hell even the descriptions on several of the toys from TFA, they all to some degree hint that Rey and Ben/Kylo are "mysteriously connected." Though she's had some Force sensitivity, it wasn't until the interrogation scene that her power "awakened." Was Kylo the catalyst? Who's to say?

Prior to the release, Rian Johnson was tweeting pictures of red thread. This was taken to mean the Red Thread of Fate, a Chinese belief that the gods tie a red string between two people who are destined to be together to help one another through something and ultimately become lovers.

Rey and Ben are yin and yang. Not perfectly white or black. Both are conflicted and prone to anger and benevolence. With both of them, there is BALANCE.

Believe me, I see TOOOOONS of critical flaws in their relationship, but we're also in a world where space magic exists.
Xeoman
Posts: 11532/11607
You guys know my feelings, nobody was answering me on FB haha (probably for the best there...)

I agree Rose could have been a lot better. That whole arc just seemed pointless (if only Poe was told about the plan). Finn was like the one character I felt was the most consistent, but it's too bad everything going on around him was pretty dumb. And did anyone else feel like the anti animal cruelty message was pushed pretty hard? So they freed the animals... and not the child slaves. Kind of funny.

I wish I could get into Kylo and Rey like you guys and others. I liked Rey a lot in TFA, but here not at all. Kylo was better, but him together with now Nazi Clown Hux, how am I supposed to be intimated by the First Order with these two calling the shots? Like you said Elara, Rey and Kylo's shift makes no sense. Let's not forget that only mere days separate the events from TFA and TLJ. Days ago she see's Kylo kill his own father, but now she's getting a little blushed seeing him without a shirt and wants to be buddies. Just doesn't seem believable.

As a fan of big expansive worlds, imagination, and sci-fi, it really bothers me that this entire movie was basically just like one day of content with two ships at a standstill in space and that's literally about it. The scope of this movie feels so minuscule compared to all the others. This is really Snoke's ship and the leading crew of the Resistance? WTF. The action in Rogue One was 10x better and bigger in scope.
Elara
Posts: 9590/9638
Overall, I liked The Last Jedi... though it does have some serious plot issues. I actually like Rose since she seems to be a character that embodies what the Resistance fights for... but yeah, I was rather pissed at how anticlimactic Snoke was... I mean... really?

And the Reylo scenes are good overall, but it just seemed a bit rushed. Maybe if it had stretched out over more time, but it just seemed like it went from "You're a monster, I despise you" to "I feel so alone and you're the only one that gets it" faster than a Formula 1 driver. I mean, I am intrigued... I really am... but it just was too fast.

Anyone else feel bad for Hux being reduced to comic relief? I loved the opening bit with him and Poe since it seemed much like something Poe would do... but by the end, I felt bad for him.
Lord Vulkas Mormonus
Posts: 4539/4539
Huh, looks like photobucket finally kicked the bucket, I just removed it, lol.
Xeoman
Posts: 11531/11607
Vulkar your layout is all broken and hard to read.
Lord Vulkas Mormonus
Posts: 4538/4539
Yeah I'm part of the party that loved VIII. I feel like it changed a lot and was a little anticlimactic with Snoke, but I really liked what they did with Kylo Ren and Rey. When I'm not on a tablet I'll offer more thoughts, but I was a fan.

I'm not sure how I'd rate it compared to the others, but I think that I liked it better than at least I and II.
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Xeogaming Forums - Entertainment - Last Movie You Saw? Thoughts?



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